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Old 01-12-2009, 04:09 PM
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Default First act of Business for the Rules Commitee

Our first step will be a trial run with the 1.9 class specifications. As a starting point we'll use the Scale 4x4 R/C Rules as a jumping off point. I'll post them below for everyone's review. Take your time and run through them with your club and find out what you like and what you don't like. If you don't like a rule or spec then have an alternative to it; don't just say you don't like it. In order for this to productive we need to keep the communications clear and concise.

Again, this forum is viewable to all, but only the Clubleaders and Scale 4x4 R/C staff can post.

We won't move on to another set of rules or specs until the current one is complete so as to keep things orderly. Once everyone has agreed on the rules and specs, we'll close the topic and add the new rules and specs to the Official list.

Keep in mind the "Scale" aspect of these classes. These are not pure rock crawlers or off road buggies, so the rules and specs should reflect that. There are plenty of ruling bodies around that have set rules and specs for those classes of vehicles.

First on the block is the 1.9 Class
Quote:
1.9” Class – Modeled after typical street legal off-road vehicles
Chassis must be OEM stock or custom ladder style that must extend over the axles. OEM suspension may be modified in any way. Construction material is not restricted.
Tires are restricted to OEM 1.9” size. If the tires are cut down 2.2’s the they must fit onto a standard 1.9” rim and not exceed 4.25” in height 1.75” in width. Flywheels brand wheels and tires and 1/18 scale Nylint brand wheels and tires will be allowed.
Must run a complete body, bumpers, fenders, doors & tailgates must be intact. Some fender trimming is allowed but the basic shape must be retained. A shortened or lengthened body is allowable. A tubed bed must have a functional bed area capable of carrying a full-size spare laid flat (rear fender and tailgate rules to not apply to tubed beds).
No 4 wheel steer.
No axle “dig”
Wheelbase and width is limited only by your body, but it must fit within the body’s fender wells.
Vehicles must be “run what ya brung.”
Battery must be placed on or within the chassis.
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  #2  
Old 01-12-2009, 05:45 PM
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Will reduced 1.9's (Pablo's 1.5's for instance) be allowed in 1.9?
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Old 01-12-2009, 06:25 PM
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I think it'd be safe to say upto and including 1.9".

I'd also like to bring to the table a 50% coverage rule, where at least 50% of the width of the tyre must be covered by fender or flare when viewed from above. I know "real" reg require full coverage, but that is not possible, in most circumstances, with most axles.

Another thing, but I don't think we can implement it, out of fairness because it's my beef, is the term "scale".
I fully blame the manufacturers and these "one body fits all" design, btw

What is "Scale 4x4" and more to the point, what scale is it?.



It seems, in the most part, the term "Scale" has been hijacked and ridden into the land of simplification. When someone says "This is my scale truck" I really want to say "What scale?"

Scale now is just a term defining a r/c 4x4, like buggy and touring car are.
The concept, to most of the world, save a few purists of scale being a something evenly reduced is size, to a strict and known ratio has gone west.
Where as we're supposed to be all "scale guru", but we park a 1/7.8th Rubicon (that's what the HPI scales out as, at the wheelbase) next to a 1/12th F350 or Hummer and not seem to care.

No other organised rule set would accommodate this. You wouldn't see 1/12th and 1/8th pan cars racing together.

But, the downside to my rant is that it's restricting personal choice of what one can build, and turns people away. That's both bad.
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Old 01-12-2009, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by dremelit View Post
Will reduced 1.9's (Pablo's 1.5's for instance) be allowed in 1.9?
I would say yes, I don't see how it would give an advantage to the driver running on the course. So I couldn't foresee a reason someone would object to it.
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Old 01-12-2009, 06:39 PM
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The way I look at our definition of "scale" is like this. Step back from the model and take it all in as a sum of it's parts. Given the constraints of the parts available does the whole truck work as one. Do the wheels and tires fit proportionately with the body? This question should be applied to all aspects of the model, from scale tools to drivers figures.

The irony is; this isn't an exact science since we're all working with ba$tardized scales anyhow, due to the manufactures blurring of scales.

What you don't want is Tamiya Jeep Wrangler (which looks proportionate to 1.9's) showing up as a scale build with Emaxx or Jugg or some other outlandishly big tire.

I've always tried to justify scale by "would this be something I might see being driven on a street/hwy". If my answer was anything other than a yes then I would be inclined to not deem it scale.
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Old 01-12-2009, 07:12 PM
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That's as close as we'll get, I think, on all fronts. Besides, as I say, my beef

Anyway, spleen vented

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Old 01-12-2009, 08:33 PM
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The problem with the 50% rule is that it pretty much rules out some really cool bodies (OG Blackfoot for instance), and on a modified rig you won't have 50% coverage anyway.

While I agree a Lunchbox with TXT axles should be out, there has to be another way to set it up to allow the bodies we want to build. A stock Hi-Lift has less than 50% coverage.

On another note, let's get a driveshaft rule in there. Motors on axles are fine for a comp rig, but scale trucks have driveshafts, full stop.
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Old 01-12-2009, 08:46 PM
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I have one exception, I'd like to put forward to the drive shaft rule:





Twin Detonator based scalers. We have about 8 of them here in Sydney, and I want to stick up for my guys, in letting them run.

These look more scale (imho) than a lot of live axle rigs. If we are to call "the drive line/suspension is not scale", that rules out anything that does not have front engine and the correct suspension for the body.

That's where the fun stops.
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Old 01-12-2009, 08:56 PM
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The motor's still on the chassis, so I'd let 'em run.

Those do look good
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Old 01-12-2009, 09:01 PM
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Cool

I think that's where the rule is defined, then. All electronics, with the exception of steering servos, or wheel position censors (there are some anti-lock breaking and traction control doo-dads that use behind the wheel pick ups*) are to be chassis mounted.

I'm easy on the wheel coverage rule being dropped, but how scale would a Proline Suburban (@ 6" wide) look with Wheelie King axles?. If we're aiming at a "would this be something I might see being driven on a street/hwy" rule of thumb, some relation to track width and body width should be observed (for 1.9", of course).

Our scale class under the ARCC has always stipulated this, even back when the class was open to 2.2"s, and it's worked. It's ruled out WK axles, but people manage. I agree that it makes it hard for 'foot F150s, and just about any stock Highlift () but the new Losi's have seen to that problem (for new builds, anyway).

Although, 'foots still look a bit monstrous on 1.9"s







*not that I know of any being used, but, simpler to allow them now rather than amend later

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Old 01-12-2009, 09:03 PM
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The simple solution to that is that axles with direct drive motors (a la Clod style) are not allowed. Motors must be mounted in/on the chassis.
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Old 01-12-2009, 09:52 PM
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I totally agree with the motor position rule. Like has it has been said "The motor must be mounted to a chassis bound transmisson or to a chassis intergrated tranny (ie...Twin Det., XC's, and TA02's)"
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Old 01-13-2009, 12:32 AM
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Maybe we should settle on what "scale" should actually mean. Obviously we can't work on a strict 1/10 or 1/12, etc basis as nothing actually works to those exact scales. I still believe it should be the sum of all the parts...does the truck look realistic? Does it look like something you might actually see driving down the road (not trailered)? Along those lines is what scale means to me.
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Old 01-13-2009, 12:45 AM
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Yes. If we go by the essential definition, a Losi MRC is scale (a scale much closer to 1/10th that 1/18th ), but not in the "spirit" of the class.

I agree, for the purpose of the 1.9" Scale class, a build with the end result resembling a road legal vehicle in correct proportions is "scale".

Maybe, then we need to look at the class title and remove some ambiguity from it - "1.9 Scale _____" ?

Tuff Truck? Road Legals?
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Old 01-13-2009, 09:50 AM
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Yes. If we go by the essential definition, a Losi MRC is scale (a scale much closer to 1/10th that 1/18th ), but not in the "spirit" of the class.

I agree, for the purpose of the 1.9" Scale class, a build with the end result resembling a road legal vehicle in correct proportions is "scale".

Maybe, then we need to look at the class title and remove some ambiguity from it - "1.9 Scale _____" ?

Tuff Truck? Road Legals?
How would the Losi not fit within the parameters? I've only seen one in a box so I'm 100% sure about its size, but I would think if you can make it work with your body of choice and tire of choice then it should qualify.
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