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Micro R/C Trux! Anything smaller than 1/12 scale. VMGs, Mini Z's etc!


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  #1  
Old 08-29-2019, 01:12 PM
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Default Budget WPL Build

Welcome to my super budget WPL C24 build.

Some of you old-timers might remember my teenaged misadventures with a purple, and then yellow, balsa wood bodied, tummy tucked TL01 Range Rover. And then I tried to build an electric 1/5th scale baja truck from my old Savage 21. And a few other things. Back in the days when everyone got super excited about the TLT announcement - finally a scale front axle! Man things have changed.

Anyway, ten years down the line I now have a partner, a dog, and a mortgage so I have to keep things cheap and simple. Can you get much cheaper than a WPL?! I also have a Helion 1/18th truggy thing from which I'll be stealing the electrics (ESC/receiver/servo combo plus battery) and any other parts which seem appealing.

General plans are to keep it as scale as possible, paint it up as realistically as possible with some weathering, and try to make it as capable as possible with suspension articulation directed mods.

You all know how a WPL goes together so I won't bore you with that. My first issue was with the stock shocks binding up almost immediately. So I nicked the shocks off the Helion truggy thing and got to work. The rear shocks went on pretty simply:



At some point I want to go back and go with a separate spring/shock to add to the realism a little. Articulation is reasonable enough for a "scale" truck:



The front end had me stumped for a while. I didn't want the shocks leaning like they are in the back because live axle trucks definitely don't have that setup up front. Plus there's no room to do it the same way that I did in the rear anyway. So I whipped up these brackets (actually they're version three or four, but I got there in the end) which juuuust about squeeze the front shock mount between the axle and the drag link:



You can see them a little better here. They simply bolt under the screws holding the axle halves together. I might make a new bracket one one side at some point to incorporate a panhard rod mount and switch to three link front suspension. I also want to switch the knuckle that the drag link goes to to make it longer. Should be able to entirely eliminate bump steer and make the steering much more responsive, but I'll hold on that for now. I also hate hate hate the reverse Ackermann steering geometry which is something that seems to plague a ton of live axle RC trucks. Like, I get it, it's cheaper and simpler to set them up that way. It just looks awful at full lock. Again at some point I want to reverse the steering knuckles and run the drag link behind the front axle (correcting the Ackermann geometry), and fabricate an arm in front of the knuckle to run the drag link to.



The shock top mount aint pretty but she'll do for now. I'll whip up something a bit more elegant further down the line. I just want to get the damn thing running first!



So after four or five hours of hiding in my garden shed multiple evenings after work I have a running chassis! The rest of it should go together in an hour now, it was the suspension fab that slowed me up. Really looking forward to putting a battery through her before tearing everything back down to paint and weather.



In the meantime, did anyone else have problems with the diff and pinion binding in the axles? I'm having the same problem front and rear. With the screws holding the pinion carrier to the pumpkin fully cinched down the axle will barely turn. It's like the pinion carrier needs to be shimmed back away from the axle case to give me a little gear lash. Any ideas?

Cheers guys, I hope you enjoy my foray back into RC!

Last edited by peeprox : 08-29-2019 at 01:23 PM.
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  #2  
Old 08-29-2019, 05:14 PM
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Looks like pretty good solutions so far.

That spring perch shock mount would even work to put shocks on the leaf sprung wpls.

I had bad problems with front axle binding that i didn't get solved until i bought the metal axle guts upgrade with brass/steel gears, bearings, and driveshafts.
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Old 08-30-2019, 12:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frizzen View Post
Looks like pretty good solutions so far.

That spring perch shock mount would even work to put shocks on the leaf sprung wpls.

I had bad problems with front axle binding that i didn't get solved until i bought the metal axle guts upgrade with brass/steel gears, bearings, and driveshafts.
Did the earlier kits come with plastic axle gears? This one came with metal axle gears - no bearings though. It also has the white/cream gearbox housing (I think earlier ones were black), and the shocks were unassembled whereas I've seen a lot of people saying theirs came preassembled in their versions of the kits. I have been eyeing up the "metal upgrade kit" mainly for the bearings and the metal driveshafts.
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Old 08-31-2019, 11:18 AM
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I got to spend the afternoon working on this today. Some progress was made.

The all-in-one electronics combo I'm using looks like this:



This little unit includes a receiver, ESC, and servo. Obviously not a patch on proper kit but it'll do for now until I can treat myself to some new gear.

It was too big and bulky to fit in the electronics box of the WPL, let alone line the built in servo up where it needed to be to actuate the panhard rod drag link. I opened up with my fingers crossed, and it was about as good as I was hoping for. It actually has a self contained "servo" inside, but all the electronic gubbins you usually find inside a servo were built into the main board, connecting the potentiometer and motor back to the main board with five wires. So I broke out the soldering iron and extended the five wires so I could mount the main unit in the WPL battery box and fit the servo up front where it's meant to be.



With that done, I plugged in the motor and all system were go electronics wise. I gave it a couple of minutes of running before deciding that the steering setup as-is is crap, and I needed to work more on my suspension setup.

The rear springs weren't working out. Ride height was low (yes please) and articulation was good (yes please) but the large tyres would just hit the arches before they were even half way through the suspension travel. The shocks also needed some preload clips to keep the rear arches off the tyres. Moving the top of the rear springs back about 10mm left me with slightly higher ride height, and resulted in the tyre touching the arch right at full compression. The stronger effective spring rate from the more upright shocks meant I could do away with the preload clip, achieve a more normal right heigh, and could utilise more droop during articulation.

Up front I discovered that the rear upper control arm from my Helion truggy thing was almost perfect as a panhard rod.



The servo horn is now almost in the right place (perpendicular to the panhard rod drag link), but the panhard rod drag link is slightly too long. I need to come up with a way to shorten it by 2-3mm. This setup allowed me to move the drag link on top of the knuckles (getting it out of the way), and raised the knuckle panhard drag link connection by about 5mm, helping to minimise bump steer.

In that shot you can see my awful original shock tower. Far too bulky, and relied on being mounted to the electronic box cover. No good. So I decided on a new plan. I whipped up these little guys



"Surely they won't take the strain of a shock and spring?" I hear you question. What if they were just shock mounts? To make this work, I needed to shorten the springs. I cut out one full coil and reshaped the end of the coil as best I could. I used the original bottom cups as new top spring perches. The two screws that I used to mount my lower shock brackets to were spaced -just- perfectly that the spring snaps over the two screw heads. With the screws snugged down it holds the spring pretty well.



I super glued these top spring perches to the chassis in lieu of any better idea



So now I'm rocking separate spring and shocks up front. Shortening the spring and moving them inboard relative to the shock lessens their control of body roll - bad for high speed road driving, great for articulation. The spring rate is still a little high but I can mess around with spring rates another time.

Not a great picture but you can just about see what's going on



One day I'll get around to actually doing the body, but sorting out the steering as best I can will be the next job.

Cheers for now!

Edit - here's a not-quite-so-rubbish photo of the new setup up front


Last edited by peeprox : 09-01-2019 at 12:35 AM.
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Old 08-31-2019, 10:38 PM
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I dunno, my wpl was the bobbed M35. I didn't get one of the Yota trucks to play around with yet. The diff cases aren't a great fit, when i built mine up seating the pinion gear took an excessive amount of force.

I might remake the shock mounts to have a lip or something top & bottom to help locate it to the frame so there's more than just 1 screw into plastic holding compression to keep it from rotating. If it works, it's all good

You could get the draglink a little flatter if it connected to knuckle on vehicles right, so it won't have as much bumpsteer as suspension cycles.

I thought these were 4-linked so they didn't need a panhard bar?
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Old 09-01-2019, 12:49 AM
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Yes, drag link was the term I was looking for. I've edited my post to reflect it.

While you shouldn't need a panhard rod in a four link setup, there's a lot of slop in this setup from the factory. 2-3mm of side-to-side movement is enough to really mess with your steering throw in such a small truck.

Option 1 would be to drop the four link and go with three link and panhard rod. If set up correctly this should totally eliminate bump steer as the axle is forced to move side to side by the panhard rod in the same arc as the drag link, keeping the knuckle in the same place relative to the servo horn at all times.

Option 2 is to pick up a proper ball link kit for the suspension which should cut the free play to almost zero. This would get the steering response to almost where it would be with a panhard rod. Bump steer would still be present, but as you said getting the drag link as flat as possible would help with that. Even moving the knuckle end of it up 5mm has improved it dramatically.

I'm definitely looking into switching which knuckle the drag link goes to. It was one of my first thoughts when I saw the kit. I couldn't believe they'd designed the drag link to go to the nearer knuckle rather than the further. It would have been a simple change to the design of the included drag link but would have improved bump steer out of the box. I might try extending one of the upper control arms from my Helion truggy thing (already being used as a drag link due to ball joints) to make that work.

Do the M35 trucks come with any kind of shock from the factory or is it just leaf springs? The factory shocks with the Hilux kits simply screw through the chassis rail about half way up the shock body. Really odd design, but I guess when the "shock" is just a way to hold a coil spring and attach it to the suspension then it makes sense - no need for shock towers.
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Old 09-01-2019, 03:37 AM
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The girlfriend took the hound to canicross this morning so I had some time to fiddle. I mounted an expedition into the attic to see if I could find any of my old radio gear.

In the dark corners of the loft I found my Sanwa Gemini II. Now kids, back in the day 40MHz radio was the dogs danglies before 2.4GHz became standard. This is a 3 channel so I have room for a two speed gearbox when I get to that point. The receiver is nice and small as well. The only problem is that the battery is kaput so I'll need to order one of those.



I think I'll stick with this for now rather than picking up a 2.4GHz setup. It gives me all the adjustments I need including arc/curve adjustment (nice for throttle control when crawling), and dual EPA (nice for setting up the steering where the throw isn't 100% matched left-to-right) which aren't things I'm going to be able to find on a super budget 2.4GHz setup.

I tried finding one of my old ESCs but it looks like they were all sold or broken long ago. I had a nice Novak Super Rooster, a couple of LRPs, some M-Tronics ones - decent stuff for back in the day. All I have left is my used-and-abused M-Tronics Super E-Truck which maaaay be slight overkill for a WPL...



So far I've spent 25 on the kit, and 8.60 on aluminium bar and angle for fabricating stuff. So I'll need to drop a couple of quid on a new transmitter battery, and for a cheap ESC of some kind.

I also switched the drag link around. I chopped two UCA from the truggy and with a little super glue and heatshrink I had myself an extended drag link. I clearanced the knuckles a little at the same time as they were contacting the lower shock mount. I ended up swapping the track bar back to the lower position. There's not much ground clearance lost, but it was fouling on the shocks in the upper position.



I now get full steering range in both directions until the hubs hit the stops.

I might actually just play with it now for a while...
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Old 09-01-2019, 11:14 AM
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Made a schoolboy error this afternoon.

I didn't want to go lipo, this being a budget build. I have a nice Pro Peak fast charger and I know what I'm doing with oldschool NiMH batteries. Plus I already had a pretty new pack from the Helion truggy that I wanted to use.

It wouldn't fit in the WPL battery bay, so I was going to run it in the bed under some kind of cover. While playing with it in the garden I found that that put the COG way too far back. Any kind of reasonable hill climb would see the truck falling over backwards. Using an rubber band to hold the battery just behind the front axle totally changed the climbing ability.

There's absolutely no space to run the battery there. So I put my thinking cap on. I messed around with split battery packs and saddle packs when I was younger so I've done some battery soldering before. I had a quick measure up and I could fit one cylinder of batteries behind the sills/rockers down each side of the truck.

Out comes the scalpel and I sliced away the heatshrink on the Helion battery pack. I soldered in a jumper wire and the result was this



The Helion "deans" connectors were super tight. It was an absolute pain to plug the battery in, let alone unplug it. I dug out some of my old real deans connectors and the female side plugged into the male Helion connector on the ESC nicely.

Maybe you can see where my schoolboy error comes in. I soldered the deans connector on to the battery leads and plugged it in for a test. Nothing happened. I picked up the truck to move it around and felt that the batteries were getting rather...warm. Wisps of magic smoke started to rise from the ESC. I managed to unplug the battery within about 20 seconds of plugging it in, but the ESC got so hot that the battery cables unsoldered themselves from the board!

I called myself a ding-dong and mused as to what to do next. I'd already ordered a transmitter battery and cheap brushed ESC this morning so wasn't too fussed that I'd killed the Helion radio gear/ESC combo thing, but I figured I'd try to fix it. I took the ESC apart again and couldn't see any black smudge marks so had a go at soldering the battery wires back on again. I got it back together and plugged the battery back in. It lit up! Steering worked! Reverse worked! Forward did.. not. Obviously fried one of the MOSFETs.

So all the Helion junk went in the bin and now I have a real excuse to upgrade to proper radio gear. I have everything else bar the ESC and transmitter battery so once they arrive in the week we'll be rolling again.

I extended the motor wires to give them a bit more slack - all the electrics should fit in the radio box up front now. With the batteries slung underneath the WPL battery box will be empty. I'll have to come up with something to go in there..

I think the battery survived the ordeal. It got hot, but no hotter than my batteries used to get racing back in the day. Emptying a 3000mah battery in 5 minutes (36 amp average draw) will get them preeetty toasty.

The batteries just about tuck in under the body. No room to run the factory running boards/side steps though. I was thinking of whipping up an aluminium belly slider so I'll incorporate some rock sliders into that to keep the bottom smooth and protect the batteries.



Side on you can see that they're almost entirely hidden



COG with the batteries like this is right in the middle of the truck, and super low - the batteries hung pretty much as low as they can be.
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Old 09-03-2019, 01:17 PM
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Seeing as I have to wait until the end of the week for my new TX battery and ESC to arrive in the post, I thought I'd lay some paint down.

I've not done primer grey before so that was the choice for body colour. Also easy to lay down and look good, and I'm going for a weathered old beater truck so it fits the theme. Matte black for the front bumper, window trims, and bed liner. I might go over the inside/underneath of the body in matte black as well to make it look a little less "toy like".

Interior will be 80's brown. Still trying to figure out the best way to paint the insides of the doors. Maybe I'll whip up some door cards I can paint outside the body and then glue into place. The kit has no provisions for any kind of door cards so it'd be nice to do some basic arm rests or something.

Just laying down some grey. I'll do quite a few layers for the body pieces, and just a couple for the ones i'll go over in a different colour like the interior.



My "spray booth" in the back of my cramped 10x8 garden shed.



I also shot the topper in plain white. It looks a ton better - much more like white fibreglass than just cheap white plastic. You can see my choice of "(BMC) Rover Russet Brown" for the interior here as well.



I've done the wheels in silver for now. Not very well. I can never get metallic paints to look right. Not too bothered as I'll be heavily weathering them anyway, plus detailing the wheel bolts and other bits so it should mostly be covered. It's just a base to work on top of.



I got all that done in a few hours, so I'll let that dry nicely until tomorrow evening and lay down some more coats after a little sanding where required. Hopefully I can start doing some weathering and detailing on Thursday or over the weekend. The dashboard should be fun.
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Old 09-10-2019, 08:19 AM
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I got to put in some time over the weekend. Now that I had the block painting done I started some weathering. I've never weathered anything before and have no idea what I'm doing so there's going to be some mixed results.

I focused on the interior. This is what i started with after spraying the seats and dash in brown



The seats after working on them a bit. The gear stick and transfer case stick looked hilariously bad, so I extended the gear stick with some heatshrink, some wire, and a ball joint



The dash is about 50% at the moment. Still needs some more detailing and weathering to get it where I want. It's getting there though.



All the detailing/weathering done with Tamiya modelling paint. Nice and cosy hiding in the shed from the British rain



I did some work on the body as well. The inside of the bed, the battery tray/box, and the battery tray lid are all matte black now. I got the window trim lines all painted black by hand, the snorkel and mirrors glued on, the front grille tidied up and attached, and the headligts tidied up and glued on. Body weathering went really well on the bonnet/grille/wings but started to go downhill on the sills/rockers so we'll see if I can tidy that up. More pictures to come.
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Old 09-10-2019, 12:24 PM
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I dropped the body parts back on the chassis to give myself an idea of where I've gotten to. The wheels are not finished at all - they need quite a bit of work so are just plain jane silver right now. The topper hasn't been touched either, apart from a few layers of white paint.



The headlight area came out pretty well. I'm not going to bother with the included white LEDs and will order some warm colour LEDs to go in the headlights.



The dash looks pretty sweet in the cab but I still want to go further with the detailing. Maybe some maps, a pair of binoculars, and paint up the switchgear some more



Not very happy with the side at the moment. Hoping I can save it with some more work, but I can mask and respray it primer grey if necessary.



I feel this side worked a bit better



Gotta throw a flex shot in there as well! This is sans batteries at the moment so not bad considering it'll be heavier in use.



The whole truck needs more detailing along with tidying up/finishing the weathering in certain spots.

Still undecided on whether or not I want to sort out a driver for it. It looks weird wheeling without a driver, but at the same time I've never seen a driver implemented in a way that looks right to me. Maybe I'll do some experiments and see.
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:04 AM
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I'm really digging how the interior came out. Love the grill and lights up front.

The weathering isnt quite telling a story yet. It's got some grime that rain doesn't wash off, and some on middle of panels that should atleast lighten. I think from where it looks like you're going, the driver side you aren't feeling could use some taps with a dremel cutting wheel and redish-brown paint (trail rash or rust damage), some brown paint flecked off a brush from the wheelwells (mud spatter)
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Old 09-11-2019, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frizzen View Post
I'm really digging how the interior came out. Love the grill and lights up front.

The weathering isnt quite telling a story yet. It's got some grime that rain doesn't wash off, and some on middle of panels that should atleast lighten. I think from where it looks like you're going, the driver side you aren't feeling could use some taps with a dremel cutting wheel and redish-brown paint (trail rash or rust damage), some brown paint flecked off a brush from the wheelwells (mud spatter)
Yep, mud spatter behind the wheel arches was going to happen, but that'll go on last as it's "short term" dirt. Trying to build up the long term grime at the moment and then mud will go over the top. A bit nervous about hitting the body with a dremel attachment in case I go to far with it. I might try with a sanding drum on the corners and ridges in some places to simulate small dents.

Thanks for the tips! Like I said, I've never painted a hard body before, let alone done any weathering. I've painted a few lexan bodies in my time but nothing like this.
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Old 09-12-2019, 12:14 PM
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I decided to take a break from painting/detailing and took her out for a run in the woods. The leaves have started to drop here now so a ton of leaf litter over most of the paths making it decidedly un-scale. There's a coniferous woods on the other side of town which should look a little better and I know the paths there have some good terrain so I'll take her there soon.

A couple of shots showing off the nice tuck on the rear wheel at full articulation





The front isn't too bad either



I whipped a video together as well. Shot in 60FPS and then slowed to 30FPS when processing to make it a little more real looking.


Not very happy with the super cheap ESC I bought - although for a fiver I suppose I shouldn't have expected much. It doesn't seem like there's any way to properly program it so full speed is at about 75% throttle, making the throttle twitchier than it needs to be. It's also very "rough" at slow speeds, I guess similar to the cogging issue you get with some brushless motors. The car also seems to be very slow while not being geared particularly low. I guess that's the tiny stock motor. It does have a reasonable amount of grunt though.

At some point I want to switch to a 370 motor with more gear reduction so hopefully that'll help with both issues, and hopefully the ESC will work better with it as well.
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Old 09-16-2019, 04:05 AM
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Managed to get out to the better woods yesterday (Stockhill Woods, Somerset) which was a hundred times better than my first trip out. The terrain was totally different and leant itself far more to scale driving than the first place I went to.

I took the dog with me, which posed a bit of a challenge. She's a deaf sighthound, so she's prone to spotting something half a mile away and just running to go and see what it is. And you can't shout at her to get her to come back. I wanted to use both hands for the controller so I didn't have a spare hand for her lead. I have a 30ft longline so I tied it to my belt and let her do her own thing (within a 30ft radius of me) and it worked wonderfully. I got to drive and she got to sniff around in the woods for the best part of an hour and a half.



I need to get back out here and get some more pictures/videos. This place is so cool and perfect for scale off roading. This little truck surprised me quite a few times with how capable it is when basically stock with some minor handling upgrades. The low t-case is the biggest killer at the moment - it gets hung up quite a lot. Some careful picking of driving lines can help alleviate it but it's not ideal

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